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Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: talesofthesevenseas on October 25, 2010, 02:58:25 pm
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(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe1.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe2.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe3.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe4.jpg)
Some of you may recall from an earlier thread that I have been looking for a pie safe off and on for a while now. With the possum-belly Hoosier in my kitchen I needed a small one and because these usually held all the baked goods for a family (not just pies) in the days prior to refrigeration, they were usually larger cabinets. These were also usually made to the specifications of the lady of the house. It has been tough to find a small one, but I liked this one right away, as soon as I saw the photos.
I THINK this one probably dates to about the early 1900's- after the days of larger safes with punched tins for ventilation, and before the days of the metal pie safes and bread boxes of the 1920's and later. It looks like half the original latch is missing (I'll probaly look for an antique replacement) and I don't know for sure if those reinforced screens are later additions. Are these storm screens? (born and raised in CA I'm not sure!) I did see one other pie safe that had these in TN. Let me know what you think.
This one came with kind of a cool "American Picker" type of story, which I'm pasting below:
"...The history as much as I now of it is that; 20 years ago I was "escaping" from the big city and I decided to drive around the country. since I have always had a love for antiques I would keep picking things up. The jelly cupboard was something I found while I was in Ohio, driving the back roads. I had stopped at a little farm store and got to talking to the old fellow there, I told him that I liked old stuff. so he took me back in his barn and showed me all kind of cool stuff, including an old model T truck, but darn I had no place to put that :( I bought the cupboard since it fit well in my tailer. I bought some other cook stuff too. He told me that is wife use to make and preserve jellys of all kinds and they used to sell them but when she died he put it in the barn because he said it always made him hungry to look at it... Oh, I also bought a bunch of veggies from him, probably the best I have had. This is one of the last things I have from that "traveling time" in my life. But I am glad that it will be with someone else who will enjoy it..."
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Forgot to say the size is height 24", width 26", depth 24".
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To the left of the latch, is that a split where the other part of the catch was? Is it repairable with clamps and glue? The pics do not enlarge so I am not sure what I am looking at. I cannot tell you anything about the grid but I have never seen any storm with grids that small and I am in Wisconsin. Looks like you have found the right size pie safe for your use. Enjoy! Pickers is on tonight!
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You sound like the pickers on tv....only alot nicer!
Thanks for sharing the nice story. Need to attach to the back of your safe.
Agree. Am unable to enlarge photos.
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I was wondering about that latch too and I don't have an answer to that yet Wayward, but I will let you know when it gets here in about a week or so. It looks like it has had a bit of "jury-rigging" by the previous owners and there may even be a screw still in there. Hard to say from these pics. I decided I was OK with some condition issues. As Goldilocks would say, it was "juuuust right" for the kitchen overall and I had to work kinda hard to convince its out-of-state Craiglist seller to ship it to me, so I decided not to press the issue and decided I was OK with it if I had to leave it alone.
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Aww thanks KC! ;D Good idea to attach the seller's story to the back of the safe. I'll do that.
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Sorry for jumping the gun, Tales, I thought you had this at home. :-[
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No, I'm jumping the gun posting before I've got it in hand and can look at this or that. :)
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On the topic of jumpin' the gun.......
Looks like talesofthesevenseas is about to join the 2k postings club!!!!
;) ;) ;)
I am looking forward to seeing whatcha got on the pie safe, when it gets to you.
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I have been eyeing that myself Sara Finn.....Just waiting to yell hooray to talesof!!!!!
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You mean you guys have endured THAT MUCH of my mindless drivel? Hooray for YOU! ;)
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Tales is going to hit 2K just by replying to our drivel on this post! ;D
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LOLOLOL!
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The pie safe arrived tonight, it's pretty cool, definitely interesting. I tried to get a few detail shots, but the lighting isn't too good at night and my camera is acting up.
Here's the front left side of the door that Wayward was asking about. It has an old skeleton key lock. There is a crack in the wood next to it, but it doesn't go all the way through. The screens are interesting. I've never seen anything quite like them. They are not wire, but machine punched out metal sheets. Looks like they are original to the pie safe.
The back of it is in bad shape. It's water damaged and made of several layers of thin peeling veneer wood. On the inside of it, someone put a layer of some kind of white foam stuff. I may replace the back with a piece of old barn wood or something. It's not noticeable from the front, but since the foam stuff as been adhered to the original backing which is itself falling apart. I'll get some photos tomorrow.
The nails are all different shapes and sizes, square and round head. They look homemade. The wood is blackened around all the nails, and it looks like they've been in there for a long time. Probably whatever was handy when it was made.
Lock from the outside and some screen up close:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe6.jpg)
Lock from the inside:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe5.jpg)
The spinning latch is cast iron. A magnet sticks to it:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe7.jpg)
Here it is in the kitchen
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe8.jpg)
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It looks good in the picture! Have fun refinishing and keep us informed!!!
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I took a few cell phone pics as I was dashing out the door this morning. The view screen on my camera quit working so I'm limited as to how clear I can get these photos, but I'll give it a shot. More pics to come.
The front and sides of the pie safe are in really good shape. No rust or tears anywhere on the screens and everything looks to be original. The top and inner shelf have some dark marks where something hot may have been set down, and you can see on the top there are some light spots that look like water damage. I think I'm going to try a little mineral oil to see if that might hydrate the light spots and help blend them in with the rest of it. You can see the light marks in front of the iron and the dark marks in front of the bowl.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe9.jpg)
The back is in really bad shape. It looks like cheaper materials were used on the back and there appear to be multiple layers of thin veneer. I didn't want to alter the pie safe in any way, but this is in such bad shape, I think it warrants replacement. I'd like to hear if you guys agree.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe10.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe11.jpg)
Inside the back of the pie safe is a thin layer of Styrofoam! Now that has got to go! I think my course of action will be to very carefully remove the Styrofoam and see what it looks like underneath. I expect it will look pretty bad, judging by the condition of the back of the pie safe. There are holes going all the way through and the veneers are badly warped. I think the thing to do is to remove them very carefully and cut a piece of wood to fit the back, ideally a piece of old barn wood, or maybe upgrade to something as nice as the wood on the front. I could also try to find a piece of wood similar to whatever the inner layer of veneer was like. I could use some ideas and suggestions. Maybe several pieces about 3" wide would look nice too? Here's the Styrofoam:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe12.jpg)
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Another thought- Should I consider replacing the back with a similar sheet of thin wood veneer? This would allow me to use very small thin finishing nails to attach it. Maybe I could even reuse some of the nails that are already back there if I can get a hold of them. I'm thinking going with something thin like they had originally might be better than barn wood or higher quality wood, because I could be less invasive in attaching it due to it being thin and light weight. It would also take just a couple of nails.
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Nice looking pie safe, Tales. I see you have a little bit of work. I would glue and clamp that split by the latch making sure to wipe off all excess glue that oozes out while it is still wet. I would also replace the back. Not sure how thick it is but I would guess 1/4". I think the only panels that thin and wide would be plywood. Finding plywood with a clear pine face may prove to be a challenge. I am not sure what else would work. You might want to browse your lumberyard and see what they carry. The one piece back DOES add stability to the whole case and keep the corners square. I would be very hestitant to use pieces (such as 3 narrower vertical boards) as I do not think they will give you the strength. It depends on how that shelf is attached inside. It looks like it is nailed from the back into the edge. Maybe someone else can chime in here and suggest a more appropriate back. The one that is on there needs to go.
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Good point on stability Wayward. I hadn't thought about that. The rest of the box is very solid, but no sense in doing anything that would destabilize it as it ages over time. One piece would mean less nailing too. Is there something like the fake wood paneling used in mobile homes, but made of real wood? Thin stuff made to look like multiple boards, but in a sheet? The pieces that are on there now probably add up to 1/4" but are maybe 1/16" to 1/8" each. I'm going to Home Depot on my lunch hour to pick up a couple of things and I'll do some looking to see if I can find a suitable replacement. I'll try some local lumber places too.
I would have liked to use antique materials, but I don't know if it is going to be possible on this. But I think that I will keep it as non-invasive as possible, with the idea that I might be able to find a sheet of something period correct that could be put in at a later date.
I agree, the backing should go, as much as I hate to remove something original, there is a point when original condition ceases to be a plus and becomes a minus. Looks like it's also torn up from the bottom edge, like critters were going in after crumbs, since they didn't have a key to open the front! ;)
On the split, I could use a C-clamp and some wood glue quite easily to mend that crack and keep it from getting worse.
I think the only way to date this is going to be by the screens, hinges, swing latch and lock. I'll try to get some better photos of these tonight.
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I thought about suggesting paneling but then...it looks like paneling. There used to be luan (mahoghany?) paneling, and maybe still is, and then you could use the back of the paneling rather than the grooved face. That would give you a solid looking wood face in the inside back of your pie safe. The back was unfinished so that could be stained in your case. It is a darker wood like unfinished mahoghany rather than light like pine. There are also wainscoat panels in light, med, dark shades but I think they are wood paper face over masonite. If you could find real wood veneer wainscoat paneling in a thin thickness, that would give a period look to your inside pie safe.
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OH! I hadn't thought of Wainscoat! That has some possibilities and I could even potentially find some antique stuff that could be repurposed.
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You can try to pull (unscrew) a screw from the latch...carefully Those are datable (I think) and the screws look original to the latch...
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I can look at the slots in the screw heads to see if they are manually slotted without having to remove one. I need to look at it under some magnification to say for sure (My eyes aint what they used to be) but I think they are manually slotted.
I took a look at Home Depot and didn't like anything I saw, except for the wainscot. Although it is in smaller widths, since it is tongue and groove I think it could be firm if I nail it correctly. I'm going to see what I can find in the way of salvaged wainscot from old houses. That would allow me to do a period repair at least. I also picked up some wood glue so that I can address that crack.
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Huh, luan is available at the Home Depot near me - comes in huge sheets (4' by 8' or so), but it's fairly inexpensive. I usually find it with the plywood that has a fairly nice surface finish (1/2" and 3/4").
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I saw some large sheets of kind of pressed composit stuff, but I would really like to use materials that were available at the time the pie safe was made. They do have new wainscot at Home Depot and I could do that for about $12 no problem. But I'm thinking if I can find some salvaged antique wainscot that came out of a Victorian it would be ideal. I think I'm going to hold off and go antique.
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I just heard from a friend who had asked if I wanted some salvaged stuff from her Victorian remodel. I asked about wainscoting and she is pretty sure she has some. So I think I'll hold off on doing anything for a bit to see if this pans out when she is back in town in a week or two.
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those look great together!
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@Marcylove: You mean the bowl of old kitchen gadgets? I thought so too! I hadn't planned to move them from the Hoosier, but for some reason the ol' bowl really seemed to want to sit with the pie safe. They seem to make a good couple. ;)
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the hoosier and the safe! Everything looks good! My FIL has a hoosier that I'm trying to price out now. I'm gonna have to move it to see any marks. I'll post it...
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Thanks! That Hoosier is one of my all time favorite things, thanks to all the help I got from this forum on doing the restoration. I'd love to see a photo of the one from your FIL's place. They are all so different from each other I find them kind of endlessly interesting to see. They are always full of surprises from a design perspective.
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Divine timing TOT7S.....great timing to get period materials!
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Oh man, what a lunch hour I had today! I met my friend out at her Victorian and OMG... you guys would have fainted. She's doing extensive remodeling and took me through her house, carriage house, outside TB sick house and basement. The out-buildings were loaded with salvaged 1890's building materials! Sitting in her basement is the most incredible wooden wash sink, salvaged from an old San Jose business. It's all wood and about 8' long. I SO wish I had a place to put it! As much as I was dying to back my car up to her front door and start shoveling things in, my little cottage-y house could never hold it all.
What I did come away with was a nice board that was one of the original 1890 pantry shelves. It will make a nice two-piece back for the pie safe. I started telling her about my plans to redo my kitchen counter with an antique sink and wooden drain boards, and the next thing I knew we were loading the old cast iron porcelain-coated 1909 patented kitchen sink into my car. It's in great shape, just needs a good cleaning, no chips in the porcelain. We were also looking at some big slab-like boards that are about 20' long that were counter tops from one of the old downtown businesses that I think will be great, period countertops with lots of history.
My friend, being the sweetheart that she is and wanting to get stuff out of her way, declined my offer to pay her for them. So I'm going home to measure my counters tonight. I think there is a big project just around the corner!!! I'll post the sink/counters on a separate project topic and will post some photos of how the pie safe turns out.
P.S. I'd never seen anything quite like the tuberculosis sick house. It was a tiny cottage the size of a child's playhouse, with just enough room for a single bed and a chair. It had screen windows, because people believed that you needed to be out in the fresh air to try to cure the TB. The father of the original owners lived out there in the back yard!
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I think one word sums up your lunch hour: JEALOUS! That's awesome tales. Have fun!
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You so deserve great days like this!!!! You have had a eventful year....now on to fun eventful things!!!!
Thanks for sharing all your adventures!
Wow, that TB house....really puts the "harder days" to reality.
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AMAZING Tales can't wait to see the wonderful things you do with all this!!!! I know it will be beautiful!!!! :D
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Thanks guys! It's been a good weekend. Yesterday I made it through a whole sail this time without ending up asleep in the V-berth, so I'm getting stronger. YAY!! We sailed from our berth in the Oakland Estuary, out to Angel Island for a barbecue. Not much wind so we had to keep the motor going to help our little Clorox bottle along, but it was a fun day out on the water and I'm really happy that I was able to make it through a whole day of sailing. I came home and slept from 7:30pm until 7:30am the next morning, LOL!
Today has been a productive day on the pie safe project:
Here is the 1890's pantry shelf before it was repurposed into the back of the pie safe:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe20.jpg)
Here is the pie safe outside with the back removed:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe21.jpg)
Looking in from the front with the replacement boards installed.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe22.jpg)
Back in the house I gave the whole thing a good wipe-down with mineral oil:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe27.jpg)
I need to touch up a couple of spots of paint on the old pantry boards, looks like I missed a spot with the mineral oil too...
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe26.jpg)
From the outside, all nicely oiled:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe25.jpg)
And now that I have a camera again, here are the hardware close-ups:
Up-close on the keyhole latch. Just for fun I tried a skeleton key I had sitting in a hardware drawer and... CLICK!! It was a perfect fit and the latch works perfectly now! I still need to glue and clamp the crack. You can see it pretty well in this photo. I just have to borrow a clamp from my neighbor.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe24.jpg)
Up-close on the cast iron swing-latch:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/PieSafe23.jpg)
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OMG tales! What a transformation! But then again, when it's you doing the work that should be no surprise :D It looks perfect along side the hoosier and the 'new' boards look as though they were always there.
Awesome work and great results!!
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Yes, GREAT job on the back boards and oiling, Tales! Looks real nice next to the Hoosier.
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Thanks, I am happy with how it is shaping up. Good ol' mineral oil is doing a good job of bringing out the color of the wood and blending in the scars.
After pulling off the back, I got a good look at the nails, since I had to pull the old nails out with pliers before the pantry board went on. They were definitely square cut nails and they were all different lengths and sizes. Not uniform at all. Some were so badly rusted that the heads would pull right off. You can see the square cut nail heads in the two photos of the latches above. However, it would not surprise me at all if the nails pre-date the pie safe. Looking at the screen I keep thinking 1900 is probably the date it was made, although the two latches look like they could be older to me, I think this was cobbled together from older parts. Does this fit with what you guys are seeing age-wise?
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I was pretty sure it wasn’t a pie safe, but not knowing exactly what it was I just kept my mouth shut …… until now. The following picture was scanned from my kitchen collectibles book. Then a Google “Image” search found this great picture and comments. To wit:
http://bowerbirdz.wordpress.com/2009/02/19/vintage-thingies-thursday-vintage-meat-safe/ (http://bowerbirdz.wordpress.com/2009/02/19/vintage-thingies-thursday-vintage-meat-safe/)
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Following up on cogar's lead I came across this....
http://artantiquesmichigan.com/furniture/country-primitive-meat-safe-wall-cupboard/
How about a compromise? Steak and kidney pie, rabbit pie, mince meat pie !! :D
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very cool! ;D
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Ah! That one right above sure does look like mine!! Does the source it came from say how old it is? Looks like I've got a meat safe! Whaddaya know!
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The one in the add is dated 1880. Wonder if mine could be that approximately that old after all? Now that I'm searching for them as a meat safe I'm seeing similar ones dated between 1880 and 1900 so I guess mine will fall into that range. Cool to know what it really is! Many thanks for this one Cogar!!