Antique-shop.com
Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: greenacres on September 22, 2012, 08:23:54 PM
-
Here's the Ax I took to "Antique Roadshow". There is no handle.
-
Wow and what did they say?
-
We thought it was from the Absecon Indians. They told us it was it was pre-historic. The biggest they ever saw and the nicest. They thought it was worth $500. It was found while a house was being built in Absecon, NJ. It was a joke between my husband and myself that he thought it was worth more. It was the reason I entered the lottery for the tickets. They were free. Now they want $150.00.
-
greenacres, the better name would be "native American axe" given it was found in NJ.
It could be anywhere from 1,000 to 13,000+ years old.
HA, if it was pre-historic ....... then it wouldn't exist.
They really can't "date" stone or flint, they assign a date to it depending on it's "shape" and/or where it was found. See link below:
Grooved, Ground Stone Axehead, Eastern Woodlands cultures, Woodland Period (800 BCE-1000 CE), Stone (Granite?),
http://art.missouristate.edu/arthist/exhibit1.php?E=1&P=36 (http://art.missouristate.edu/arthist/exhibit1.php?E=1&P=36)
-
Thanks cogar! Every time I look at it I think how hard life was then. It's so heavy. It feels similar to a sledge hammet of today.
-
Thanks cogar! Every time I look at it I think how hard life was then. It's so heavy. It feels similar to a sledge hammer of today.
"Every time I look at it I think how hard life was then"....especially if you were a woman..... ;D ;D
-
Thats what I thought !! What is the length !! We had several of those from the Caddo culture here !! Typically known as war clubs since a stone ax would have a good edge !! Did you notice that it has no cutting edge or flaking ?? Average size for these is about 6 in. in length !!
-
Looking at this "Ax"head....i,m of the opinion that this was most likely used for pounding as opposed to cutting...it may have been the "Mash"..hammer of its day...like this one
-
one here...designation Hammer...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/STONE-AGE-TOOL-PRIMITIVE-ROCK-HAMMER-WEAPON-Has-GROOVE-Attach-/140853785070
-
I think that picture would be different if taken now. It would be flipped! ;D
-
Thanks Wullie! I it gives me so many laughs when I look at it, and memories.
-
Thanks Wullie! I it gives me so many laughs when I look at it, and memories.
you know me...ever the joker....Ug...Ug... ;D
-
Yep ;D
-
Thanks Wullie! I it gives me so many laughs when I look at it, and memories.
Then I think ...Clan of the Cave-Bear...by Jean M. Auel...might be right up your street.....
-
It was used for both cutting and hammering. greenacres' axe was not used very much as they were reshaped and resharpened with use.
greenacres, did I see you on the tube?
-
On the tube...please enlighten us.... ;D ;D
-
Greenacres, I personally would call yours a “stone hammer” rather than an axe …. simply because I really don’t think it is very old, antiquity wise that is.
Native Americans had been using flint and/or obsidian for several thousand of years and it was used for making arrowheads, spear points, knives and axes because of the extremely sharp edge that could be napped (flaked off) on them. Flint shards are used in some present day surgeries because they are “sharper” than the sharpest surgical tool that is factory made.
Here is a picture of my 5 ½” stone axe head …. and I am calling it an axe simply because it actually has a “beveled” cutting edge. But its cutting edge is no where close to being as sharp as the cutting edges on my 6 ½” knife or spear point pictured above it.
I have no idea where the axe head came from because I got in a “box lot” at an auction, thus I assume it was found somewhere in central WV. My father had a white/cream colored flint axe head that he found somewhere locally. It was about 4 ¼” b y 3” in size.
I found my spear point in Herkimer Cty., Upstate New York, and it was appraised to be around 10,000 years old by an Archaeology Professor at the local college. A true Paleolithic tool.
-
My ex and I used to collect artifacts and at time of our divorce had over 1000 perfect points, several like greenacres and a trashcan full of broken points plus a multitude of scrapers and other items !! Most all came from the Sulphur River and a large campsite close to it !!
-
No, I didn't make the tube, lol But, It's really a lot of fun. Standing in line to get in you get to see what other people bring. I would love to go again. I won't pay $150.00 a ticket though. I got spoiled going for free!
-
No, I didn't make the tube, lol But, It's really a lot of fun. Standing in line to get in you get to see what other people bring. I would love to go again. I won't pay $150.00 a ticket though. I got spoiled going for free!
Drat!.....and here was me thinking.....Greena cre,s on Youtube!!..... ;D
-
I'll have to bring something better next time. I always felt it was from the Absecon Indians. Antique Roadshow gave me the wrong info. Do you believe it!
-
greenacres, the better name would be "native American axe" given it was found in NJ.
It could be anywhere from 1,000 to 13,000+ years old.
HA, if it was pre-historic ....... then it wouldn't exist.
They really can't "date" stone or flint, they assign a date to it depending on it's "shape" and/or where it was found. See link below:
Grooved, Ground Stone Axehead, Eastern Woodlands cultures, Woodland Period (800 BCE-1000 CE), Stone (Granite?),
http://art.missouristate.edu/arthist/exhibit1.php?E=1&P=36 (http://art.missouristate.edu/arthist/exhibit1.php?E=1&P=36)
...how can you say if it was prehistoric..it would,nt exist...of course it would exist....prehistori c only means ...that it was before a recorded time....then you go on to say...that they can,t really date stone or flint......but go on to say that your piece was dated by an expert.....bit of a contradiction.....d on,t you think...
-
I'll have to bring something better next time. I always felt it was from the Absecon Indians. Antique Roadshow gave me the wrong info. Do you believe it!
Personally speaking I don,t think they did give you the wrong info....you found this hammer head on land that was previously inhabited by Absecon Indians....so it stands to reason that it is an Absecon tool.......there is nothing to suggest that an indian from a different tribe came along one day and lost his hammer...and eons later it was found by you,.....
-
Thats correct Bigwull and most likely it is,, but they also traded many things with those from other areas !! I found a few black obsidian points which is not found here !! These items were also used as money !!
-
I fully understand that Mart,....but as it stands..there is no conflicting evidence to suggest that this hammer head,is anything but an Absecon piece....
-
I've been reading about Absecon. The tribe was called "Absegami". There were other tribes there too. Not much is written about them on the internet. I'm seeing other tribes used similar tools.
-
Not disagreeing,, just adding to the thread !!
-
Found this picture. Just to let you know mine ax is 10in. long.
-
This site is great! http://ushistoryimages.com/new-jersey-colony.shtm
-
You could always make a handle for your cool little tool , greenacres ... it is in/near hunting season all around the country .... I'm betting that you could easily score some deer sinew/gut for attaching it to a nice 'found' stick & create a nice 'authentic-style-to-to-era' display ...
So .... now that this antique item has got some history ... could it be considered post-historic ?
:-X
-
To cool! I'm jealous about Antique road show! ;D
-
Lol, you should see when they are in your area. Go to their website. Check with the tickets. They maybe free. You could take your statue!
-
10 in. would be a big one !!
-
Bigwull, I interpreted “pre-historic” as meaning “before history”. And given the fact it was in reference to a “tool” that was fashioned by a member of the Homo genus, specifically a Homo sapien or human, then pre-historic would literally mean ….. before the history of humans. Thus, a “pre-historic human tool” would be an oxymoron. The 1st word negates the 2nd two words.
And Bigwull, that was a scientific fact, they really can’t date stone or flint. Just like they can’t date Stonehenge via the stones that were used for its construction. They actually estimate a date for Stonehenge via Radiocarbon testing of the contents of the soil around and underneath of those stones.
Stone and flint tools are also dated via Radiocarbon testing if they are found in an undisturbed location. But that doesn’t tell them how old the actual tool is, only when it was deposited there.
Stone and flint tools are also dated via their specific shapes based on literally thousands of other “finds”. For instance, the Clovis Point was first found in 1929 in the US southwest, from where it gets its name, Clovis, New Mexico. To wit:
In early 2009 a major Clovis cache, now called the Mahaffey Cache, was found in Boulder, Colorado, with 83 Clovis stone tools. The tools were found to have traces of horse and cameloid protein. They were dated to 13,000 to 13,500 YBP, a date confirmed by sediment layers in which the tools were found and the types of protein residues found on the artifacts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clovis_point (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clovis_point)
Bigwull, I found my spear point with my bulldozer … when I “cut” away about 1 ½ feet of soil it was buried under. Another ¼” deeper and it really would have been history. ;D I called the College, the Prof asked where I lived, and he was there within 40 minutes. After looking it over very carefully, and the place I uncovered it, he told me all sorts of things about it, including the 10K date.
Bigwull, “dated” artifacts are only good ……until they find another one that is older.
Bigwull, check this out, it’s in your “backyard”. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doggerland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doggerland)
-
Similar thing happened here in our county with a bulldozer !! About a half mile behind my parents farm a man was clearing land for pasture and along a small creek made a swipe with the dozer and uncovered half of an indian !! He stopped work and called NTSU who did the research and completed the dig !! Odd thing was it was not a typical Caddo burial !! They thought an accident or something similar led to his being in an odd place rather than a mound burial !!
-
Yes mart, that what they were saying. The biggest they ever saw, lol Thanks for the info Wullie. I'm very interested in that subject. There was just a special on History channel that was fascinating. They were explaining why they found Japanese chards in South America. There were larger land masses back then and it was easier to take a boat from one continent to another. They were saying that archeologist felt that American Indians were really Europeans that traveled over in boats thousands of years ago. They found that there are really 5 types of people in the world. It's very involved, but I love that topic.
-
Back in the 1950's, my folks moved to a different house, and I like most kids did at sometime decided to dig in the backyard. I was probably down about 3 feet when I came across a cache of unbelievable items. It was obvious that I had found someones collection that had been discarded years ago, probably in an outhouse at the time.
Within a matter of a few days I had uncovered petrified fossils, including land snails about a foot long, complete geodes, artifacts including hammers, axes, points, etc.
My wise decision at the time was to consign my finds with an antique shop in a neighboring town. Not real smart of me to be selling what I now believe were Knife River Flint spear points for a few dollars.
The only thing I kept was a softball sized extremely heavy for its size red "rock", that I've been informed is a meteorite. :-[
-
If you knew then what you know now! Isn't that the saying. :'(