Antique-shop.com
Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: Sam on June 25, 2013, 06:50:01 PM
-
Hi, I'm wondering if anyone can help me with a pewter vase that I have in my possession. I did get it valued via a well known site back in 2009, and was told that it was a pewter vase possibly by WMF. It is 14.5" tall complete with it's liner and has an engraving on the base as it was given as a golfing bogey prize in 1898. I was told that the engraving had lost it some of it's value and that it was worth £120-£180. As the vase is so unusual and I like it so much (am not planning on selling it ever!) I have over the years often searched online to see if I could find out anything about it. It had seemed pretty unique, but I have recently discovered that it is just about identical to a couple of pieces online that are by Louis Coustaury. The signature on them is quite prominent, but mine has no signature at all. There is a XVII etched on the bottom and a zigzag mark which could be an MW or WM? Is it possible that it could be by L.C. or does the lack of a signature totally discount that? It's such a lovely item that I often study as there is such a story to be read in the figures all around it. I've added a photo, hope it works.
Would really appreciate any comments on it :)
-
That is really unusual. I can't unfortunately tell you anything about it as it is way out of my area. It looks French to me. I like tha way the one cherub is lifting another in a fish net. The fact that it is old and has to do with golf adds value just as a golfing item. It should really be seen by an expert. I believe it could be a very important item if authenticated. How did you acquire it.
-
Can you please straighten the pic so we can see it upright ?? Also need to see the markings on the bottom with the ones you described !!
-
Thanks for the replies, the vase belonged to an aunt that passed away. Sorry about the sideways image, that happened in the upload from my iPad, but it is around the right way and much larger if you click on it. I can add a photo of the bottom tomorrow, bit too late for me now in the UK :)
-
Here's the image turned right-side up .
-
Thanks Fancypants !! I just can`t make heads or tales of a sideways image !! Hurts me old neck !!! ;D
-
Seems quite unusual for a golf trophy !!
-
Some more images, taken on my iPad, have no idea if they will come out the right way up or not!
I agree it does seem odd as a golf trophy.
-
Ohhhh dear, my images are all skew-if again, sorry. Again they will be larger and the right way round if you click on them. Sorry they're not very highly defined. I can try and get a better picture of the markings on the base later, but you may be able to get the idea anyway. The MW is really just a zigzag squiggle.
Been trying to find out about Louis Coustaury, but all I can find is a date of death at 1897. Would it be usual for a sculpter to leave a piece unsigned?
-
Thanks Fancypants !! I just can`t make heads or tales of a sideways image !! Hurts me old neck !!! ;D
..get yerself a laptop... :D.
-
we recently had a pewter plate on here...that...turne d out to be very rare...the owner was advised by one of the members to contact a Pewter Society...the Ip man should be on today...he,s the one for this....
-
Thanks bigwull :)
There is currently a similar bronze vase on eBay priced at £22,000!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/L-Coustaury-19C-French-Gilt-Bronze-Vase-Figurine-/160946198178?pt=Antiques_Decorative_Arts&hash=item25792416a2
I'm under no illusions that my vase is worth anything like that. I've also seen a similar pewter vase that was worth I think between £1000-£1500. But both had the signature. Although, it's nice to know, the price isn't my main interest as like I said, it's a keeper. I've just never felt that the info I was given via the valuation was correct.
-
Hi,Sam...just done some searching and found the Ip mans original post...here,s email ad
enquiries@pewtersociety.org ..they do not charge for advice, let us know how you get on...
-
Firstly - stunning vase but what in the hell was someone doing engraving it for a golf trophy ?!! Those crazy Victorians...
It could have been engraved afterwards and not made as a golf trophy.
Can you not remove that circular base ? Would probably have stood on a socle base that was removed by your aunt or someone so the vase could stand on it's own.
In Fancypants post of the image - on the shoulder of the vase in the centre are some leaves - are they words beneath those or is it just how it appears in the photo ?
I assume you've checked everywhere. I'd expect to see more on the original base though but the sides could be marked, even if just a monogram somewhere.
-
Lot 1034
http://www.jamesdjulia.com/auctions/div_catalog_286.asp?pageREQ=no (http://www.jamesdjulia.com/auctions/div_catalog_286.asp?pageREQ=no)
It did not sell and had a presale estimate of $1000-1500. I'm not surprised.
A pewter version of a bronze vase also online. This bears the signature and in the auction trade we'd describe it as " after Louis Coustaury " as it's a reproduction or later casting ( not a fake )
Yours is better defined.
Surprisingly little about this person online.
-
Thanks again for the replies and links. I will see what the pewter society can tell me, thanks bigwull.
Ipcress, believe me, I have scoured every bit of the vase for marks, but nothing that I can see. The whole thing seems as one, so I don't believe I could remove the lower edge. Mine is definitely more detailed than those others, with the cherubs, fish, birds, reeds, and it's a mermaid caught in the net. I must admit, when I first saw it, I actually thought it was a bit ugly, but it has grown on me so much. One of my favourite possessions :)
-
Try to get a pic of the marking !! I agree with Ipcress that this was not done originally as a golf trophy !! And yes it would be a bit unusual for a sculptor to not to sign it !! Although there have been a few !! Kind of hard to build a reputation as a sculptor if no one knows who made the piece !!
-
Thanks again for the replies and links. I will see what the pewter society can tell me, thanks bigwull.
Ipcress, believe me, I have scoured every bit of the vase for marks, but nothing that I can see. The whole thing seems as one, so I don't believe I could remove the lower edge. Mine is definitely more detailed than those others, with the cherubs, fish, birds, reeds, and it's a mermaid caught in the net. I must admit, when I first saw it, I actually thought it was a bit ugly, but it has grown on me so much. One of my favourite possessions :)
I don't mean the lower rim, i mean the base plate with holes. What is this plate attached to ?
The Pewter Society are unlikely to know without a touchmark or similar point of reference.
The definition is wonderful - the putti and the net in particular - so my opinion is that this is unique, not a pewter recast of a bronze vase. It appears to lean to one side though, using the table edge as a perpendicular.
The prices asked on Ebay for the Coustaury vases are laughably high
-
I love this piece and agree it was engraved much later than when it was made!! I also agree with frogpatch and think It should really be seen by an expert. it could be a very important item if authenticated. Take her to a local museum!! Beautiful piece!
-
Here's the thing about a local museum - unless they have an expert in Art Nouveau, and particularly metalware, they are going to struggle without a mark or point of reference. Museums have curators and specialists for certain areas and then refer other items to specialists elsewhere - i catalogued a collection of paintings for a large city museum here in the UK. Unless that base plate comes off and there's a mark on the inner side of the vase, it's difficult to attribute this.
The work on the side of the vase is excellent, worthy of WMF, Wiener Werkstatte etc. I think some of the wavy rim is clumsy / thick when compared to other parts but as a whole it's a lovely piece of Art Nouveau but the fact remains that the engraving devalues the piece. Had it been a golf themed trophy of the same quality from the same period i think the value would be higher. Without attriubtion i'd say £300-500 but wouldn't be surprised to see it sell for more.
This was WMF and sold for £1,700
http://www.liveauctioneers.com/sothebys/item/125025 (http://www.liveauctioneers.com/sothebys/item/125025)
These were WMF. Better quality, scarcer and a pair. £10,000.
http://www.liveauctioneers.com/sothebys/item/107208 (http://www.liveauctioneers.com/sothebys/item/107208)
-
The disc doesn't look as if it would be easily removed, and I'm pretty sure that I can see directly onto the other side of it from the inside so nothing hidden there. I will try and get better pics up later tonight ( hubby has me roped into some decorating at the mo! )
I have learnt a new word today - putti, thanks :)
-
Just hang around !! You will learn a lot of new words !!