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Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: talesofthesevenseas on September 12, 2009, 02:13:35 PM
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If the deal goes down as planned, I should be picking up this neat little rustic Chinese bench for $20 next week. The question is, should I leave it as it is, or put a deep red stain on it to return it to something close to the original finish? It looks like it is extremely worn and weathered, but the seller says it is still very sturdy. It looks like it has absolutely no finish left on it and I guess it will boil down to if it has been sanded already, it would definitely stain it. If it is just weathered from outdoor use, I might consider leaving it be.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench1.jpg)(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench2.jpg)(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench3.jpg)
What I'm thinking of something like I did with this piece- No sanding, leaving the surface original, just the deep red stain. Here are the before and after photos:
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseCabinet1.jpg)(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseCabinet2.jpg)
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Restoration of furniture is the court of last resort in my book. However, many people won't touch an orginal rough piece because they don't know how to do it or they don't have the workspace to accomplish the task. Many will pay top dollar for a piece restored. It's just a personal thing with me and most vintage pieces of furniture will find their value increased with a decent restoration. Some artifacts are destroyed restoring them. Coins, guns, objects with a patina will be ruined if polished or restored. If it's a very old antique piece of furniture, I would seek other qualified opinions before restoring. My .02 pesos.
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Looks like a good score for a 20-spot .
Can't tell 4 sure , but it looks wet from wash/rain and dry from weathering .
You could always let it dry out for a month , if 'wet' , and just oil it for a few months to bring some life back into it ... and decide later about the finish .
Are parts of it teak ?
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Looking at the photos, it is hard to tell. I'm thinking it's been sanded already, because I don't see any sign of lacquer or paint on it anywhere, even in protected areas. But the end of it definitely looks like its water damaged. I'll know more seeing it in person. It's for me personally. It is going next to the Chinese bed, replacing the trunk I have sitting there. Honestly it would look better with the stain than as is, I'm just arguing with myself over if I should do it or not, more for moral reasons than practical ones. ;)
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I guess I have learned over the years to take some time.....not hurry things. Because of this I go with fancy's suggestions of oiling - letting it sink in - oil again - as many times as necessary to "rehydrate" the seemingly rain/washed out/weathered wood. You may even like the wood once you do that...and it will have alot more "aged" personality.
However, if you like the sleek/finished look that you so aptly accomplished with your other piece...you can then do that!
Boils down to personal taste.
Good buy for $20.
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Yeah I like the idea of rehydrating, the wood would might have a color change too, it looks bone dry right now. I can always try that first and at the very least treat the wood by rehydrating it, then reassess what I want to do. I'm in no hurry to rush it.
You know I just double checked the ad, those are two different benches. Bench 1 is in the first and second photos. Bench 2 is in the third photo. I just emailed him and said I'd take both if they are not spoken for.
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When staining "raw" wood one has to remember that any knot holes and "end" grains or cut edges will absorb more of the stain resulting in those areas being much darker and you can never un-do it.
With large grain wood such as pine or oak the entire surface of the boards are subject to this problem.
So, unless you want the above described "effect", before you stain anything, buy yourself a quart of shellac and a quart of denatured (wood) alcohol and mix them together 50-50. Both quarts if a big project, smaller batches if needed. (mark the container and seal it tight, it will keep forever.)
Anyway, just give all wood surfaces a "sloppy" coat of it and let it dry (couple hours).
Then, either light sand (220 grid) or steelwool the surfaces smooth. Careful though, some finishes tell you not to use steelwool.
Note: Most any new or weathered wood has tiny little "whiskers" that are almost impossible to sand off. Thus, the shellac acts like a "shaving cream" and firms those "whiskers" up and the steelwool will cut them right off.
That process seals all the surface area and the stain goes on nice and even. One should do that especially if they are going to paint the wood because the paint goes on much smoother and the next owner won't have any trouble stripping the paint back off. ;D
WARNING: always do a "test spot/patch" where it is not readly visible.
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Any idea what the history of that style of furniture is? After reading this post I just randomly came across a very similar piece in a listing for a local auction -- I attached pics from the auction listing.
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Tales should like this. it's a japanese alter table. go well with her other furnishing's.
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Nice!! I heard back from the seller of the two benches, looks like I'll be picking up both next week.
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That's good news on the pair , talesof .
One large , one small .
My guess would have been Chinese safety-stilts , D&b .
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if Hubby is not carefull. tales is going to have every thing from china & japan bought up here in the states. can't say I blame her.
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LOL... Heaven help the poor man!!! ;)
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talesof.....I am pondering that your bench is what is called a Chinese Long Bench or a Chinese Low Bench. Used around the outsides of a room.
The table listed above by Monolith is in fact an altar table - the sides curve upwards to the heavens.
Just for grins, came across an interesting chinese bed you might have fun viewing http://www.asiagalleries.com/products/chin3_chinese_canopy_bed.html (http://www.asiagalleries.com/products/chin3_chinese_canopy_bed.html)
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Beautiful bed! There are a surprising number of these beds around, every one of them different and unique. They are fascinating and some of the more elaborate ones even have secret drawers and compartments in them. I got some neat feedback on a Chinese History forum once from people who could remember an elderly aunt or grandmother who had one and that these beds were a favorite place for storytelling. I love to think about who might have had mine!
I have seen a lot of these little benches. These ones look pretty typical, there's a lot of variation on the basic bench. I am picking them up tonight and the seller also has a small stool available, same condition, for $10. Hard to go wrong with that!
Here's some examples of similar ones:
(http://www.antique-chinesefurniture.com/productsimages/antiquelongrectangularbench_86357.jpg)
(http://www.humblehouse.com.au/chinese-furniture/gallery/gallery-images/bench(lg1).jpg)
(http://www.aurea.co.uk/Graphics/pine-bench-chinese.jpg)
And here's a restored one on Ebay going for $379:
http://cgi.ebay.com/JJ-Chinese-Antique-Typical-Ming-Antique-Long-Bench_W0QQitemZ200002727034QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAsian_Antiques?hash=item2e91176c7a&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116 (http://cgi.ebay.com/JJ-Chinese-Antique-Typical-Ming-Antique-Long-Bench_W0QQitemZ200002727034QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAsian_Antiques?hash=item2e91176c7a&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116)
I'll let you guys know how it goes.
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there known as garden bench's.
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Thanks D&B, good to know that! I did some hunting online and it looks like a some of them have been spiffed-up by putting a clear varnish over the old wood. I have some old Chinese buckets that that was done to that look really good. That might be an option for these guys, hydrate them and then just do a clear coat to protect and make them look nice again... if it even needs it after rehydrating.
Speaking of rehydrating, do you guys have any recommendations on what type or brand of oil to use for something so weathered?
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It would depend on the wood (according to me) and how you intend on finishing it .
If it were my project & I was going to keep it/them , I'd first acess if the wood has 'cooties' or still had water in it ... if so , I'd execute the bugs and let it 'dry out' for a month or so .
I'd then check it for other past or active rot & insect problems (dryrot included) and abate/stabilize those issues first .
Am still curious about what kinda wood you've got there , tales .
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I am curious too. Looking forward to picking 'em up in a couple of hours! That's a good idea to check if they have any rot/bug issues. They have been indoors in an artists studio though for what I think was at least several years. So I think the weathering occurred earlier rather than more recently. I'll give them a good inspection though, thanks for the heads up on that.
Here's a photo of the stool. Same condition, size is 19" long x 10" wide, 23" tall
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseStool.jpg)
Here's the dimensions on the benches.
The smaller one is:
41"L x 8"W x 26"H
The larger is:
59"L x 7"W x 17"H
('zactly the right length to go along the end of the Chinese bed!)
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Well I'll tell ya one thing, no one will ever accuse these benches of being reproductions LOL! I ended up taking two benches for $20 each and the stool for $10. They don't look like they ever had any kind of paint varnish or anything on the wood. There is no trace of any finish anywhere, just bare wood. I don't know what kind of wood this is. It is not a hardwood, so I don't think it is elm. The benches and stoo are all VERY weathered and very dry, but none-the-less, very sturdy.
Here's the best of the three. It is the slightly taller in height, slightly shorter one in length than it's counterpart. No sign of any repairs, no rot, no bugs. Just very old wood, lots of scars.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench5.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench10.jpg)
This is the second bench, longer in length than the first, but shorter in height. It is in severely weathered condition, but it has charm.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench8.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench6.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench7.jpg)
Here is the stool. This one has quite a few empty slots, signs that I think mean that it once had the same kind of decorative pieces on it that the benches have, and a couple of supporting cross members that are no longer there. It, like the others, is sturdy as a rock, despite extreme weathering. It is bigger than I thought it would be, the slab of wood for the seat is about 4" thick.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseStool2.jpg)
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseStool3.jpg)
Finally, the group of three, posing with a Fiestaware pitcher for size comparison. In reality, the boards that appear lighter in this photo are only slightly lighter in color from being protected by the piece above them. A lot of that is from the flash.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseBench9.jpg)
Now for the big question: What to do with them. Well, to be honest, I think they are so weathered, that they would have more value if they were varnished, so that they could function as attractive indoor pieces. Looking at what similar benches are selling for on Ebay, it looks like people probably would prefer attractive/functional over original/functional. The condition right now is very much like driftwood. However, I think the cracks and splits are part of the charm and I don't think any sanding would be appropriate. Nor would it do the least bit of good! But the preservationist part of me hates to alter anything so original.
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Me gut feeling tells me those are old, old timers.
Are they all peg and mortise construction? (meaning no metal)
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Wow These are cool Tales, great score, sure you will make them look great. Nice Fiestaware too ;D
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So...to preserve and not alter.....rehydrate is the next step!
They definitely have lots of personality/charm about them.
Are you keeping them or selling?
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Congrats on getting all 3 , talesof ... bargain price too !
Hope I'm not going too far out of line , but I will anyway & suggest the following :
(disclaimer here - the look of varnished deeply weathered wood almost gives me hives & reminds me of nasty epoxy-dipped wood items at roadside souvenir stands)
I'd brush them down with a solution of 75% mineral oil & 25% mineral spirits repeatedly for a few months (in a well-ventilated spot) , let all of the mineral spirits evaporate for another month & then use tung oil for the rest of their lives (if they were mine) .... my other choice would be to leave them as-is (after a good scrubbing).
Nice group of Chinese peasant furniture items , talesof .
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Thanks guys! ;D Answering the questions below...
They are 100% peg and mortise. No nails, no metal on them anywhere.
They look to be 100% untouched in any way shape or form. I'm thinking long and hard about if I want to do anything to them at all. I will take some time to mull it over. I'll also drop an email to the Chinese antique dealers who gave me the insurance appraisal on the Chinese bed. They produce a series of videos on Chinese furniture and I'll get an opinion from them too. I keep waffling back and forth about what I ought to do. I'm not used to the look of wood that is so weathered, so maybe it's me that needs fixin'. ;)
I am going to keep at least one bench and the stool for sure. I may sell one bench. I haven't decided yet.
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I've been running searches this morning looking at similar benches and stools, trying to get an idea on the value. Looks like twenty bucks was quite a bargain. I'm not finding many that have not been refinished. I haven't been able to figure out if unaltered is a plus in this case, but the more dollar signs I see, the cooler they look, LOL.
On Craigslist, unfinished, paint residue, similar condition, $185:
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/atq/1371448719.html (http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/atq/1371448719.html)
Refinished, $395:
http://www.silkroadcollection.com/mix9009-chinese-bench.html (http://www.silkroadcollection.com/mix9009-chinese-bench.html)
Refinished bench, dated at late 1800's for $799:
http://www.orientalfurniture.com/oriental-furniture/ANTIQUES_PH068.html?utm_medium=shoppingengine&utm_source=yahooshopping (http://www.orientalfurniture.com/oriental-furniture/ANTIQUES_PH068.html?utm_medium=shoppingengine&utm_source=yahooshopping)
Refinished Bench for $1200 *gasp!*
http://hollyhockinc.com/products/Tables_Consoles_LR_WHITE/End_Tables/Bench,%20Chinese,%20ZZA-22,%20B.html (http://hollyhockinc.com/products/Tables_Consoles_LR_WHITE/End_Tables/Bench,%20Chinese,%20ZZA-22,%20B.html)
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Just got an email from the seller of the benches. He just offered me this old Chinese rake, (Looks like a hay rake to me,) that came from the same person that the benches came from. $10. I accepted. No idea what its worth yet, but certainly looks worth the risk. Same type of wood and construction. No idea what kind of shape the handle is in.
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x124/talesofthesevenseas/ChineseRake1.jpg)
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This just in from Eugene at
http://www.chineseantiquefurnitureshop.com/videos.html (http://www.chineseantiquefurnitureshop.com/videos.html)
Hi Claire,
I think you got some nice pieces.
Answers to your questions:
1. You don’t have to restore those pieces if they are still sturdy. Do refinish it only if you like refinished antique furniture better.
2. They are not considered very valuable pieces. You can do it in the way you like the best.
3. About 50 to 100 years.
4. Since we don’t carry pieces like this, I can only give you our prices to the public if they were refinished: benches: $180 to $250 stool:$130
5. From the three piece together photo, I see a replaced side apron on the shorter bench.
All the best,
Eugene
Chinese Antique furniture Shop
(One note the side apron mentioned was just lit up by the flash. I went back and checked and the wood is the same as the rest.)