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Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: jf935298 on January 28, 2010, 07:29:25 AM
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Hi there.
This is a bit of a tricky one. Ive searched and searched to try and identify exacly what this is. It was labelled up as a "salt glazed water feature" at an auction, but he later said he'd just guessed what it was? I bought it out of curiousity, as the plan was to simply use it as a novelty rainwater collector! but as Im unsure of exactly what it is I thought Id try and find out before I relegated it to the garden!
I believe its french in its origin. It's definatley used for liquids due to the tap on the bottom. Inside there were two sloping panels that met in the middle to allow some liquid to pass (one is missing)
Does anyone have a clue, or can point me in the direction of where I can find out what it is? Ive looked at antique water filters, boilers etc...but Im hitting a bit of a wall.
(http://i45.tinypic.com/aemkbp.jpg)
(http://i48.tinypic.com/2imbdq1.jpg)
(http://i46.tinypic.com/oa7o6c.jpg)
Id really appreciate any help anyone is able to help me find out what my latest impulse buy used to be!
Thanks everyone
Mike
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Rain water collector would have been my guess (only makes sense ;)) But if it's French in origin, possibly something connected to wine making??
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Thanks for the reply.
Yeah I thought rainwater when I saw it (and is why I bought it) But it looks like its had some kind of top on it at some point and it looks a little elaborate for just rain. Im sure the French bods would have just used a bucket ;)
Also if you look at the bottom picture it 'looks' like theres some kind of breather hole running up the top left corner? Is it some kind of booze fermenting thingy? Ive no idea!! I can speculate forever, but Id love to hear if someone definately knows what it is?
The auction was of items from a local salvage/antique shop that went under, so thats a closed door!
Cheers
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Cool & odd item , jf935298 .
Although it does kinda look like a rainwater cistern/dispenser ....
I'm wondering if your item is made of terracotta , and if there are any traces of beeswax in/on it .
Perhaps it is a grape fermenter (wine) ....
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Hi, thanks for your reply.
yes it is both odd & cool. It does look a bit cisterny...if it wasnt for the decorated tap you'd swear it belonged over a loo!
I dont think its terracotta. Its 'very' heavy. I can barely pick it up on my own. I popped out to look at a chipped corner on the underside to see. It 'looks' like a clayish/stoneware salt glazed jobby....but Im no expert.
Heres a pic for clarification if it helps anyone help me find out what it is?
(http://i45.tinypic.com/2dgunom.jpg)
thanks again!
Mike
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....oh, and I cant find any beeswax ;)
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Can you take a better pic straight down into the "urn". Does it look like the piece was "poured" all at once or the bottom was added?
My first impulse was that it reminded me of a terra cotta chimney flu - which would match handsomely with with the rainwater collector - seems a French flair to it!
(http://chimneysweeper.com/images/clay-liner-2.jpg)
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Hi,
Its been fired as all one piece. Its a fair ol chunk. It stands about a metre high!
Ill take a better pic of the inside tomorrow when its a bit lighter outside if it helps anyone.
Thanks again,
Mike
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I'm going to add a 'perhaps' here on this one .
Maybe this was a water dispenser , in a kitchen .
Of course , it would have had to sat on something quite substantial , if it was used above floor height ; it'd be most convenient is if was off the floor (in an alcove , etc.) .
If this item was this , perhaps the baffles inside of it would have prevented some 'sloshing around' of the water , when being filled via bucket(s) 'blindly' overhead & would have kept the worker from being doused .
This guess also assumes that there was not indoor running water , at the location where it was used (prob. had to huck it up from a well) .
Another possible here is that the small 'vent' inside of this item was a spot for a dowel-ish thingie (for a water gauge) .... perhaps could also be used as a siphon , in the event of a hand-valve clog , or to remove excess sediment .....
The image posted does seem to indicate that different liquid levels left their marks on it's interior .
It also seems too nice to be sitting out-of-doors .
Looks like this puppy is tough enough to handle hot water too ...
Fecal matter in rivers & streams was a concern for folks in-the-know , when it came to drinking water ... not so much of a concern (way back then) for washing & so forth .
Then again , this may simply be a predecessor of an item like the modern one in the image below .
Talk about your wine-in-a-box !
That's my penny guess , so far .
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regjoe2....makes me wonder if the little hole had a item I have seen in the past for a large urn like this....
Had a pole-like "measuring" stick---it would "float" up and down with the level of the liquid inside...so that an urn kept in a higher position could reflect the level inside without totally running out or having to climb up/open the lid and look inside to see how much more was inside.
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Yep , KC .... thinking along the same lines .
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OK, heres a couple more pics of the inner bits as requested.
On having a good nosey at the inside where the opposite 45 degree panel was (which can be seen by where it joined the side) When it was in place it sealed the bottom section off completely with absolutely no channel for any liquid to pass. However, the panels that remain look to be porous. Which leads me to think that whatever liquid was put in filtered through the solid sloping panels and ran to the join where it then filtered down a vertical panel of the same material (Which can be seen on the pics below) The fact that the bottom was sealed may explain why theres a breather hole to the bottom section.
So, Do you think it could be an early brita ;) Was it an early French water filter? Ive searched and cant find anything apart from some elaborate patented jobbies. Anyone know any experts on early French water filters that can tell me Ive got it wrong or right? lol Or have any old French country relatives?
What do you guys think? Have a gander. Cheers Mike.
(http://i50.tinypic.com/2hcq3ar.jpg)
(http://i49.tinypic.com/23k3muq.jpg)
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Could this be a 'newer' version?
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/antique-english-salt-glaze-stoneware-water-filter
Notice in the third pic, what appears to be that hole/tube similar to yours, but running down the outside.
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Still believe it is for water/rainwater. Any debris/pollution would be stopped by the "filter" and clear water would go on through.
Where do you live out of curiosity - Country/State?
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I'm (mostly) on the water train with this item too .
Here's an image of another Victorian water filter , from petworthantiquecert re.co.uk .
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Could this be a 'newer' version?
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/antique-english-salt-glaze-stoneware-water-filter
Notice in the third pic, what appears to be that hole/tube similar to yours, but running down the outside.
Not sure if you have to be a member on that site, but I can only see one picture? lol Sounded interesting too! Ive browsed lots of the UK patented water filters, but havent found anything that remotely looks like the thingy I have. They all seem to be round with elaborate embossed features. Maybe the French preferred a more functional affair! (If it is a water filter!) Can you post the pic you saw here? Thanks for your help in trying to ID what it is!
Still believe it is for water/rainwater. Any debris/pollution would be stopped by the "filter" and clear water would go on through.
Where do you live out of curiosity - Country/State?
yes Im leaning towards that too. But Id love to find a record of another that works the same way to clarify. Id love to get an age on it! To answer your question I live in the UK - North Staffordshire. This was part of an auction lot of French Antiques which also contained a deco hanging ball shade and 6 Ornate Iron Coat Hooks fitted to Oak....and a wicker chair!? But Its this water thingy that really has the ol grey matter turning!
Thanks to everyone that is trying to help. If anyone has any ideas/info or has seen anything similar Id love to hear from you.
Mike
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I'm (mostly) on the water train with this item too .
Here's an image of another Victorian water filter , from petworthantiquecert re.co.uk .
Hi, Yes..mostly but I always have a niggle. I found a chappy called Juan Carlos Garling who seems to have collected a load of pictures of worldwide antique water filters together here - http://www.flickr.com/photos/juangarling/sets/72157603826560854/ Ive tried to contact him but I think the only email listed for him is bouncing. None of the pictures looks like the one I have, but maybe he hasnt seen a French one yet? (again...if it is one!) But I was hopeful he could have a nosey at the pics I had of the inside of my mystery object and tell me if it works/looks like an early water filter? But other than that Im struggling!!
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Could this be a 'newer' version?
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/antique-english-salt-glaze-stoneware-water-filter
Notice in the third pic, what appears to be that hole/tube similar to yours, but running down the outside.
Not sure if you have to be a member on that site, but I can only see one picture? lol Sounded interesting too! Ive browsed lots of the UK patented water filters, but havent found anything that remotely looks like the thingy I have. They all seem to be round with elaborate embossed features. Maybe the French preferred a more functional affair! (If it is a water filter!) Can you post the pic you saw here? Thanks for your help in trying to ID what it is!
Just click the Enlarge, under the pic. When it comes up on the screen, with the blacked out background.....run your cursor over the pic from side to side, around the middle....you'll see the words "previous" and "next" come up ;)
Won't let me grab copies :D
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http://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/parks/collections/exhibits/ceramics/ midway down
The names that keep popping up in articles are Doulton (on the Thames), British Berkfield and a few others that tout that they all started in the 1800's with gravity fed water filters for river and rain water. Another reason for the slanted insides would have been to hold charcoal up/away from the drinkable water in the bottom. However, pottery/ceramic is touted to remove 99.8% of impurities. They became extremely popular after the cholera outbreak in the 1800's. http://www.doultonfilters.com/history.htm (http://www.doultonfilters.com/history.htm)
For France the name that keeps popping up is Louis Pasteur
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Not trying to jump ship on this one , I've found many refs to 'filter stones' for Victorian era water filters , but nothing definitive of yours .
My guess would be leaning towards , maybe , diatomaceous earth - as far as the filter mat'l .... no solid evidence for this yet , though .
These guys seem really interested in liquid containers , and are closer to your neck-o-the-woods , jf935298 ( they do seem willing to reply to inquiries ) - http://oabcc.spaces.live.com/PersonalSpace.aspx
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Just a thought- Could the square shape indicate it may have been one of several in a group- Like it would have been in use in a hotel or restaurant? Does the base look grooved like it would have been fitted to another below it?
I grew up by Alum Rock Park in San Jose, CA which has mineral springs and was a "health spa" of sorts back in the Victorian era, when they used to believe that mineral waters had healthful and curative properties. Even as late as the 1970's when I was riding my horse there, I will never forget a conversation with a very elderly man who kissed the nose of my horse and hugged her. His son had brought him there to collect the mineral water because his father still believed it would cure the ills of old age. I wonder if something like this may have been used for mineral water, although I don't see any signs of deposits I would expect to see with heavily mineral-laden waters. "Curative" waters were big business back in the Victorian era.
Also in San Jose on the southern end of town we also have a "miraculous" spring in what is now the Santa Teresa area. This spring was the water source for the Native Americans living in the area, who had a legend surrounding it that a woman appeared and blessed the spring curing the tribe of an affliction (we now suspect they were sickened by body paint). When the Bernal family took over the lands, being devout Catholics, they attributed the Native legend to Santa Teresa. (They kind of ignored the fact that the legend pre-dated Sta. Teresa by several hundred years!) The Bernals would hold mass at the spring, it had blessings by the Pope and the bottles of miraculous curative water sold like hotcakes... 'specially to the folks that would come to the ranch to watch bull and bear fights! *shudder!*
But to make a long story short, there was a lot of money in health water and I wonder if your filter system was used on a larger scale for an estate, restaurant, spa or ?
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I'm betting it was for a commercial establishment or in those days a city offering such as a fine park or city building.