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Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: aj_houser on March 25, 2010, 08:31:10 PM
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I have found 2 of these. I have been told they were used as cigar and cigarette lighters in drinking establishments years ago. THe question I have is what period of time these would have been used in? They are solid brass. My understanding is the bartender had control of them and would swivel them out any time a patron needed a light. Anyone ever seen these things or have any info about them?
Thanks
In addition a status update on the adventure of clearing out a garage full of stuff. I have found things anywhere from a few dollar brass pieces up to a couple hundred dollar silver platters. So far very happy I have saved these items from going to a scrap pile.
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I'm guessing that your items COULD be used for the purpose you've described , even so , I think they're elements from wall-mounted gaslights .
One thing to look for in such items are wear-marks from glass or iron 'globes' that may have been in place , near / on the end fitting of the unit .
Here's one , in the image below , from 1910 origin ... it's been in continual use in Victoria , British Colombia (Canada) at the Old Morris ... it's known as an 'Electrolier' in their tobacco 'shop' .
I've lit a cigar from this one .
The gas nozzle is attached to a monster 250 lb Mexican Onyx base .
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There's a pretty decent history of gas lighting on Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_lighting (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_lighting)
Gas lighting would have been in widespread use from the early 1800's to the early 1900's. But that's not to say it couldn't be earlier, or later. Different places got gas lighting at different times, bigger cities first and then it spread outward. It was replaced by electric lighting in much the same way, although there are still some places using gas lighting.
If there are any manufacturers marks that would really help to narrow it down.
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No I have spoken to the gentleman that owned the bar these came out of. They were definitely used as lighters. But it appears they may have been original to the building, and living in a small historic town it probably dates to 1870. Perhaps as old as 1840. But the town really did not sprout up until about 1850, when the US sold the old Fort off. And since that period of time was a very difficult time for this area, the center of "Bloody Kansas", I would suspect improvements such as natural gas piping was about 20 years in the future. Having done some research it was produced by a gentleman named Welsbach, who was well known for his gas lighting, but this was his first attempt to produce a cigar or cigarette lighter. But in 1903 he succeeded and produced the first flint lighter, which the design of which is still used in todays modern day lighters. Think Zippo and you can see he idea. But as far as age goes, I would put this in the range of 1870 to 1880. Now the issue is just trying to find what kind of value there is to this!
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Thanks for the additional info on your cool little items , aj_h .
Although they were prob. very handy in their day .... I think about the wisdom of having swinging flaming things in the same room with alcohol & men .... and well .................. it's easy to understand why we don't use them today .
I'll bet someone here will be able to find a representative value for your 2 items .
:)
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You might want to document your information and show proof of it to some Tobaccomania sites/collectors. So unique, don't know as there is a current market value...but that is what should make this "rare".
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OK, think we're getting closer.......
http://live.vcaauction.com/Very-early-Hotel-lobby-type-wall-mount-cigar-lighter_i5279445
(http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t98/geeziesmom/10472_0411_1_md.jpg)
http://antiquesandthearts.com/AW0-07-18-2000-13-33-53
"Highlights of the 65-piece collection included a rare Vaseline hobnail glass advertising countertop kerosene lighter, marked "Owl Cigar Company New York and Florida," which sold for $2,000. A cast metal wall mounted allegorical figure gas cigar lighter measuring 12 inches in length sold for $1,800, and an Eldred "Our Special" snap handle lighter with cast cherub on elaborate metal base reached $1,680."
http://www.jacksonsauction.com/past_files/june_4th4.htm
"1097-A GAS WALL MOUNTED CIGAR LIGHTER late 19th c. Bronze bust of a cherub holding a torch which is the lighter. Lower body is a large leaf. Round wall mount has geometric designs. Highly polished. Working condition. H.8”. Out of Pittsburgh Men’s Club. Estimate........... .....$600-$800"
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I would think old west saloon collectors would be interested in this too.
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(http://www.icollector.com/images/1009/15294/15294_0763_1_sm.jpg)
http://www.icollector.com/Gas-wall-mounted-figural-cigar-lighter_i9336203 (http://www.icollector.com/Gas-wall-mounted-figural-cigar-lighter_i9336203)
1093-A RARE LATE 19TH C. WALL MOUNTED GAS CIGAR LIGHTER. Cast metal allegorical figure with dragon-like wings and a curled fish-like lower body. Figure holds a torch which is the lighter. Original gilding. Working condition. H.12”. Estimate........... .....$1,700-$2,500
1097-A GAS WALL MOUNTED CIGAR LIGHTER late 19th c. Bronze bust of a cherub holding a torch which is the lighter. Lower body is a large leaf. Round wall mount has geometric designs. Highly polished. Working condition. H.8”. Out of Pittsburgh Men’s Club. Estimate........... .....$600-$800
http://www.jacksonsauction.com/past_files/june_4th4.htm (http://www.jacksonsauction.com/past_files/june_4th4.htm)
Not being an expert in this area....and from what we are seeing I would value yours in the area of $250 to $375. I base this on the fact that it is a piece of history thus giving value to a piece. I don't rate it as high as others because it appears that others have figurines/sculpture work and more ornate work to them which in turn increases their value.
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What is anyones guess should I attempt to clean the old patina from these or leave them as they are?
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I would leave the patina as is. I have seen too many brass happy polishers buff years off antique objects and make them look like they were made and laquered yesterday. JMO.
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Agree Wayward I would leave them as they are.
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Agree with wayward and Wendy....that is what helps lend to it's age, novelty and value!!
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I'm with KC , wendy & waywardang ... just leave the old patina alone ; you can give it a 'wipe-down with a cotton cloth , just to get off any 'modern' patina that might be on it (dust,oil , etc.) , or that might get on the hands of a potential buyer .
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Anyone have any suggestions as to the best outlet to sell these items?
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I still after days and sleepless nights of searching can not find anything pointing to a value or where to even go to try to sell these things. I hate to just place them on ebay if they actually do have a value to them. But living in a VERY small town I have not outlet for an auction house except for the weekly junk auction.
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AJ you can email photos and all info you have on your lighter to any auction house - Skinner of Boston, MA. for example will email a reply in about 4 weeks and if it meets their auction value they will give you an estimate of sale, if you decide to sell you can ship your item. All info is on their web site. as is with most auction house web sites. good luck let us know how you make out.
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Wendy thank you so much for the in site. As you can tell I am very new to this, though I have found that I have come to love it! Thank you to everyone that has helped me in my endeavor so far. And a for warning I am sure I will have many, many more questions in the future! But I have felt very welcomed into this community of experts. And very slowly I am even learning a thing or two.
Thanks Again
Art
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Art, you might want to do a bit of a search on Tobacianna (sp?) collectors. Not only might you get lucky with learning a bit more about your 'lighter' you may also find a venue for selling to interested collectors. ;)
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Good idea sapphire lots of people go wild for antique tobacco collectibles and do collect only tobacco related items!!! search for some open forums like this one specialising in such and just ask ;) Art you are welcome great people on this site so so nice!!! and we welcome any questions you have.